tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post7557940784627446899..comments2024-03-17T11:05:22.464+00:00Comments on The Life And Opinions of Andrew Rilstone: Britannia perdere!Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-11261868968669501362020-12-08T22:55:08.108+00:002020-12-08T22:55:08.108+00:00(I have nothing to add at this time, but want to c...(I have nothing to add at this time, but want to check the "Email follow-up comments to xxxxx@gmail.com" checkbox.)Mike Taylorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06039663158335543317noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-50081719413603656422020-12-08T14:57:42.744+00:002020-12-08T14:57:42.744+00:00Hatsune Miku is a virtual idol singer and/or masco...Hatsune Miku is a virtual idol singer and/or mascot of a piece of software that lets you create synthesized songs. She's now also the honorary creator of anything good that was originally credited to a transphobe:<br />https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/hatsune-miku-created-minecraft<br /><br />I take "cultural Marxism" as variation of the Nazis' "cultural Bolshevism" - which, like Bolshevism in general, they thought was promoted by the international Jewish conspiracy.Sophie Janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-29188462862929217032020-12-07T17:20:24.584+00:002020-12-07T17:20:24.584+00:00In a statement I hope never gets taken out of cont...In a statement I hope never gets taken out of context, I think you're right about Hitler. The Frankfurt school were on the hit list. We all know what happened to Walter Benjamin. But I don't think they were made into a catch-all figure of blame, like the Israeli Illuminati or the CIA lizards.<br /><br />But it's also true that the Nazis' targets were often cultural. Perhaps most (in)famously with the degenerate art exhibition. So perhaps cultural Marxism just without the capped C.<br /><br />It's possibly also significant that the Frankfurt School conspiracy theory originated in America.The group had a helpfully European name, all that was required to mark them out as suspect. ("Frankfurt, that's in Yurrup y'now.")Gavin Burrowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16347163260510316959noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-46051617427686174192020-12-07T11:08:22.025+00:002020-12-07T11:08:22.025+00:00I have no idea who Hatsune Miku is.
Where does t...I have no idea who Hatsune Miku is. <br /><br />Where does the idea of the Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory having a Nazi Origin come from? It is usually traced to the 1990s (the same time the myth of Political Correctness was invented, and by some of the same people.) The Frankfurt Group itself was a phenomenon of interwar Germany, but did Hitler directly see them as part of a wider Jewish conspiracy (except in so far as he presumably saw everything as part of a wider Jewish conspiracy...) <br />Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05786623930392936889noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-5777788736194298202020-12-06T18:55:59.689+00:002020-12-06T18:55:59.689+00:00yes . PH. sorry.yes . PH. sorry.Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05786623930392936889noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-31462545622674249592020-12-05T18:16:36.621+00:002020-12-05T18:16:36.621+00:00Sophie Jane, yes I agree with you too! Some conspi...Sophie Jane, yes I agree with you too! Some conspiracy theories can seem like harmless idiocy. Flat Earthers can continue boycotting the model globe industry forever, as far as I'm concerned. But they're always at least latently dangerous and pernicious.<br /><br />By "the details don't matter" I meant the conspiracy theorists themselves don't seem to care. With those who claim the CIA staged S11 to get to invade Iraq, I have sometimes wasted my by pointing out the CIA opposed invading Iraq. They just immediately substitute Mossad, the Bavarian Illuminati, or something else from their shopping list.Gavin Burrowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16347163260510316959noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-54197671147068021442020-12-05T17:47:40.014+00:002020-12-05T17:47:40.014+00:00Andrew, does CH in your two comments above actuall...Andrew, does CH in your two comments above actually mean PH? I fear you may have the wrong Hitchens.ghttps://www.mccaughan.org.uk/g/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-59577221441236353082020-12-05T17:44:59.131+00:002020-12-05T17:44:59.131+00:00(Meanwhile, the latest sticker on my local bus sto...(Meanwhile, the latest sticker on my local bus stop simply says "Boris Johnson is not a prime minister. He is a nomenclator." Not sure how many people are going to parse that one even if it wasn't posted upside down, but it's of a piece with the rest.)Sophie Janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-323723929955200832020-12-05T17:39:36.630+00:002020-12-05T17:39:36.630+00:00@Andrew
It's in the nature of dogwhistles to ...@Andrew<br /><br />It's in the nature of dogwhistles to be plausibly deniable, of course... but "cultural Marxism" as a concept goes back to the Nazis, and the "global elites" conspiracy cycle is a product of and promoted by the far right. Tick the tropes off against the Protocols - and keep an eye out for the addition of blood drinking and child sacrifice to the list.<br /><br /><br />@Gavin<br /><br />I agree with all of this, but conspiracy theories don't appear out of nowhere - they're folklore spread within particular cultures. If you erase the context by insisting the details don't matter then you're missing their cultural and political significance.Sophie Janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-74561000778264178752020-12-05T12:27:15.367+00:002020-12-05T12:27:15.367+00:00"What's though to be" was originally..."What's though to be" was originally "what's thought to be". But the Bavarian Illuminati got to it.Gavin Burrowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16347163260510316959noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-90113180423947096422020-12-05T12:24:06.125+00:002020-12-05T12:24:06.125+00:00Sophie Jane is indeed right to say "The Elite...Sophie Jane is indeed right to say "The Elites" is usually code for "The Jews”. What’s though to be the oldest conspiracy theories were anti-semitic. Which in itself makes for a good reason for opposing them. (Well, that and them being completely stupid.)<br /><br />But I don’t think conspiracy theories reduce to anti-semitism. Some are, ostensibly at least, leftist. While some S11 ‘Truthers’ blame Israel for the attack, for others it’s the CIA. For others it’s the lizards. The detail doesn’t even seem important to them.<br /><br />It seems to me that what they are at root is an articulation of powerlessness. They’re literally reactionary, in that they contend we’re in a world where it’s only possible for us to react. (I haven’t read these original articles, Andrew has a stronger stomach than me. But I’m guessing the Man of Many Asterisks doesn’t propose any solution.)<br /><br />When Andrew says “the precise enemy changes” that seems to me essential. There has to be a shadowy ‘them’ - untouchable and ultimately undefinable - for the conspiracy to work. Hence the fixation with symbols of power, rather than the actuality of power. Everything hangs on the precise meaning of the word ‘lockdown’, the last election result is an irrelevance.<br /><br />You may well feel powerless in your life. Conspiracy theories give you a way, not of challenging that powerlessness, but of channelling it. I am as powerless as you. But I know things! I know who was really behind all those Black Lives Matter protests, whereas you sheeple think it was something to do with anti-racism.<br /><br />So facts are for fetishising, rather than for examining. Asterisk Man simultaneously believes that the police are too repressive, (forever figuring out new ways to menace innocent civilians) and enabling of destructive mobs. <br /><br />But what would he say if we pulled him up on this? He might come up with some linguistic gymnastics to justify it. There’s some who can even do that with ‘Trial of a Time Lord’. But mostly he’d tetchily tell us we were missing the point. And to him we would be.<br /><br />Conspiracy theories are feel-bad. But they’re there for people to enjoy that feeling, just as much as with feel-good.<br /><br />On the other hand, those masks do make your specs steam up.Gavin Burrowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16347163260510316959noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-73634286983176307662020-12-05T12:17:05.826+00:002020-12-05T12:17:05.826+00:00Sophie
There doesn't seem to be anything spec...Sophie<br /><br />There doesn't seem to be anything specifically Jewish in CH's conception of the Elites, and I would be reluctant to say that because one very pervasive conspiracy theory concerned a Jewish plot to take over the world, that any theory about a plot to take over the world is "really" about the Jews. I seem to recall that an investigation into David Icke concluded that he wasn't using coded language: he really did believe in telepathic alien lizard people. <br /><br />(But of course, if I say that I think that the definition of anti Semitism has become too wide, I will certainly be Cancelled.) Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16934052271846235431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-46085334511057708952020-12-05T12:11:53.198+00:002020-12-05T12:11:53.198+00:00I don't have a problem with the technique of &...I don't have a problem with the technique of "stone man" arguments -- where you fix the flaws in an opponent's argument, and then try to refute the improved version. <br /><br />And I don't think that "rhetorical flourishes" should be taken literally. If someone says "If I had my way Eton College would be burned to the ground and replaced by a comprehensive', it is unlikely that they are really advocating arson; and there is not much point in explaining that physically destroying and old building would not in fact address systematic inequalities in education. I think it is reasonable to assume that they strongly disapprove of elite private schools and strongly approve of non-selective state funded education, though. <br /><br />What I don't think is helpful is to say "The speaker certainly said something silly. But if he had said a quite different, and more sensible thing, he would have had good point. So he has a good point."<br /><br />"Twitter can be, and has been, used by both the far left and the far right as a medium to bully their political opponents" is a perfectly valid point. <br /><br />But C.H said that the Woke Left (specifically) have invented a technique called Cancellation, which has been used to do actual harm to J.K Rowling. And this is, I submit, bollocks. <br /><br />I used to write about an obscure comic book called Cerebus. It is unquestionably the case that many people stopped reading the comic, and told others that they should stop reading the comic, after the "this is why women were rightly denied the vote for so long" incident. Dave Sim didn't use the word "cancellation" but he said that he had been "voted off the island". <br /><br />What follows? That people who found his views on women repugnant should have carried on reading him anyway? That they should stop reading him, but refrain from discussing or critiquing his views in public? (I do believe that one or two people stopped talking to me because of my advocacy of Sim; but I no-one remotely tried to censor my essays. Some people told me strongly that I was in the wrong.) <br /><br />The nastiest mis uses of Twitter have been by the Gamergate and Puppy types: and I don't believe that you can describe them as Woke. <br /><br />I find it hard to believe that Pullman damaged C.S Lewis's posthumous reputation significantly. (He remains something like the fifth most successful author in the history of the human race.) It is possible that saying "These books contain Christian ideas" might make people who would have been hostile to the books content in any case less likely to read them. Pullman and Rowling have both circulated the "nylon lipstick" fallacy; and it is true that this is now the only thing that people who have not read the books know about the books. But I don't think that "bad literary criticism" equates to "woke obliteration". Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16934052271846235431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-40154721171467220212020-12-05T09:01:25.586+00:002020-12-05T09:01:25.586+00:00James Kabala - are you saying that it is wrong to ...James Kabala - are you saying that it is wrong to attack C S Lewis is anyway for fear it has a ‘chilling effect’?, Nick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03741867414321172768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-58539850256277204672020-12-05T00:26:26.340+00:002020-12-05T00:26:26.340+00:00Although in the case of Rowling, it’s less scurril...Although in the case of Rowling, it’s less scurrilous attacks and more widespread disapproval of bigotry. <br /><br />(I am, as always, grateful to Hatsune Miku for giving us Minecraft, Harry Potter, and Father Ted.)<br /><br />But this, I think, makes a wider point: that people who hold repugnant opinions often find it easier to believe there’s an organised effort to silence them than to understand their views aren’t common sense, obvious, or widely held. It’s one of the basic routes to right-wing radicalisation.Sophie Janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-3314386488407589502020-12-04T21:28:39.568+00:002020-12-04T21:28:39.568+00:00I think my point was that an attack on an untoucha...I think my point was that an attack on an untouchable famous person can still be scurrilous even if unsuccessful, and it can still have a chilling effect on less famous people. Maybe it was not the best example, but one with which I knew our host would be familiar.James Kabalahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02335302113772004687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-59631988477989750402020-12-04T17:34:44.558+00:002020-12-04T17:34:44.558+00:00James - I’m not sure what your point is.
Pullman ...James - I’m not sure what your point is.<br /><br />Pullman may be trying to create a world in which a Lewis was less respected<br /><br />But equally Lewis was trying to create a world in which Christianity was more respected<br /><br />I’m not sure what the difference isNick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03741867414321172768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-85458886608308847482020-12-04T14:38:35.929+00:002020-12-04T14:38:35.929+00:00J.K. Rowling is obviously beyond the reach of canc...J.K. Rowling is obviously beyond the reach of cancellation, but Twitter pile-ons are meant to intimidate lesser-known people who might want to express similar opinions. (Some of whom actually have lost an agent or had a book publication cancelled for spurious reasons. But apparently the world of young adult fiction is a very toxic place, and the victims would probably have joined eagerly in the mob against someone else.)<br /><br />Another way to put it: Obviously Philip Pullman a decade or two ago did not cancel C.S. Lewis, nor did he think he could. But was he trying, with some success, to create a world in which Lewis was less respected and Christian fantasy in general was viewed with greater suspicion, which might have a negative effect on lesser authors? I think he was.James Kabalahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02335302113772004687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-8644076326099838212020-12-04T14:10:49.400+00:002020-12-04T14:10:49.400+00:00Fake grassroots - PR or marketing designed to look...Fake grassroots - PR or marketing designed to look like a spontaneous popular initiative. The "National Smokers Alliance" from the days of Big Tobacco is the usual example; the LGB Alliance would be a current one.Sophie Janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-88764460343313341052020-12-04T13:38:12.104+00:002020-12-04T13:38:12.104+00:00Astroturfing?Astroturfing?Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16934052271846235431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-65067808486096735882020-12-04T13:28:08.113+00:002020-12-04T13:28:08.113+00:00Probably worth noting that "The Elites" ...Probably worth noting that "The Elites" is usually code for "The Jews" once you scratch the surface. Wacky specifics aside, the basic principles are straight out of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion - hence the stuff about "cultural Marxism" and postmodernism and the undermining of "our" cultural values.<br /><br />Also worth noting that the initial wave of Covid conspiracy stuff back during the first lockdown showed signs of astroturfing by the usual American "New World Order" types. Or at least, the couple of websites mentioned on the glossy leaflets I got through the door had high production values, frequent references to "commoners on both sides of the Atlantic", and ambitious but underpopulated discussion boards.<br /><br />(Though the last screen I removed from a local bus stop seemed to borrowing from the German far right, judging by the White Rose reference. The internet means this stuff gets around.)Sophie Janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-71857365549820943702020-12-04T13:23:42.115+00:002020-12-04T13:23:42.115+00:00If I point out that Jack Chick believed in a liter...If I point out that Jack Chick believed in a literal Satanic conspiracy in which the Pope created Islam in order to promote the sales of Dungeons & Dragons at Halloween, it is no help to say "But there are moderate evangelicals as well". I never doubted it. Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16934052271846235431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-36746552985934465752020-12-04T13:21:58.940+00:002020-12-04T13:21:58.940+00:00I am not interested in his wider views. I am inter...I am not interested in his wider views. I am interested in looking at two articles as an example of how conspiracy theorists think.Andrew Rilstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16934052271846235431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9987513.post-56661828164125971282020-12-04T12:55:58.490+00:002020-12-04T12:55:58.490+00:00Well, you both went to York, and you both think th...Well, you both went to York, and you both think that Tony Blair is a baddie, so you may have something to talk about. More seriously, if you have access to a public library you may be able to look at some of his wider views. Opinion seems to be divided on how well researched they are, and how much polemical.<br />You may have noticed an absence of any of my usual defences of moderate conservatism or the wider state, given that they all seem to be part of the Conspiracy.Richard Worthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09025201422909987658noreply@blogger.com